OT: Marlin Spike

[Bob La Londe]

Is there a way to put a marlin spike loop mid span in a section of
twisted rope without tying a knot in it?

Back in the winter of 1980/81 I took a small craft and seamanship course
from the USCGA (D-9) with my Uncle Paul. I learned how to back splice,
straight splice, and how to loop splice the ends of a rope, but I'd like
to make a tow harness for a boat that centers the load on both rear tie
down rings. Ideally with a float before the loop, and the splice
extending further than the length of the float. All I've ever used is
loop splices in the real world, but I could figure out the others quick
enough if I had to.

The only thing I can think if is to make two loops through the float
with two different pieces of rope.

I'd like to be able to quickly clip each end on to one of the tie down
rings on a small (relatively) craft and toss the float straight off the
back for a tow line to clip onto. This is not intended for skiing. Its
intended for towing a disable watercraft. In some cases one much
heavier than the tow craft.

For water skiing the ideal setup is to come off a pole well above the
deck with a single line on a mount that can swing easily. I have one,
although I have never used it. Never was able to ski more than a couple
hundred yards without turning myself into a torpedo.

Untwisting and retwisting a long section of rope really is not an
answer. I want to do this with nylon rope and it doesn't tend to
retwist very well. The only reason a loop splice works with it is
because tensions clamps the strands to each other after its woven.
Well, and I also lightly melt the ends so they stick in place.

The only other thing I can think if is lashing (whipping?) with a light
cord instead of splicing. I'm not sure I am a fan.

Yeah I know how silly that all sounds.

[Jim Wilkins]

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:vh3cb6$2ebtd$***@dont-email.me...

Is there a way to put a marlin spike loop mid span in a section of
twisted rope without tying a knot in it?

Back in the winter of 1980/81 I took a small craft and seamanship course
from the USCGA (D-9) with my Uncle Paul. I learned how to back splice,
straight splice, and how to loop splice the ends of a rope, but I'd like
to make a tow harness for a boat that centers the load on both rear tie
down rings. Ideally with a float before the loop, and the splice
extending further than the length of the float. All I've ever used is
loop splices in the real world, but I could figure out the others quick
enough if I had to.

The only thing I can think if is to make two loops through the float
with two different pieces of rope.

I'd like to be able to quickly clip each end on to one of the tie down
rings on a small (relatively) craft and toss the float straight off the
back for a tow line to clip onto. This is not intended for skiing. Its
intended for towing a disable watercraft. In some cases one much
heavier than the tow craft.

For water skiing the ideal setup is to come off a pole well above the
deck with a single line on a mount that can swing easily. I have one,
although I have never used it. Never was able to ski more than a couple
hundred yards without turning myself into a torpedo.

Untwisting and retwisting a long section of rope really is not an
answer. I want to do this with nylon rope and it doesn't tend to
retwist very well. The only reason a loop splice works with it is
because tensions clamps the strands to each other after its woven.
Well, and I also lightly melt the ends so they stick in place.

The only other thing I can think if is lashing (whipping?) with a light
cord instead of splicing. I'm not sure I am a fan.

Yeah I know how silly that all sounds.
--
Bob La Londe
CNC Molds N Stuff
----------------------------------

If you are set on splicing you might splice the ends of a "grommet" within
the rope.

A variant of the Prusik knot can be tied in the middle of a rope to add a
loop. It looks somewhat like the Alpine Butterfly, with more turns around
the rope on either side of the loop.

This calls it a dropper knot.
https://www.animatedknots.com/dropper-loop-knot

A figure eight loop might be better since your two ends are angled instead
of pulled straight.

If you want to impress someone you could pre-mark the center of the sling
with tape and tie it to the single tow line with a Carrick Bend.

My favorite how'd-he-do-that? is dropping a clove hitch over a bollard in
one smooth quick motion by grabbing the line with arms crossed.

[Joe Gwinn]

On Wed, 13 Nov 2024 20:08:29 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"

Post by Bob La Londe
Is there a way to put a marlin spike loop mid span in a section of
twisted rope without tying a knot in it?
Back in the winter of 1980/81 I took a small craft and seamanship course
from the USCGA (D-9) with my Uncle Paul. I learned how to back splice,
straight splice, and how to loop splice the ends of a rope, but I'd like
to make a tow harness for a boat that centers the load on both rear tie
down rings. Ideally with a float before the loop, and the splice
extending further than the length of the float. All I've ever used is
loop splices in the real world, but I could figure out the others quick
enough if I had to.
The only thing I can think if is to make two loops through the float
with two different pieces of rope.
I'd like to be able to quickly clip each end on to one of the tie down
rings on a small (relatively) craft and toss the float straight off the
back for a tow line to clip onto. This is not intended for skiing. Its
intended for towing a disable watercraft. In some cases one much
heavier than the tow craft.
For water skiing the ideal setup is to come off a pole well above the
deck with a single line on a mount that can swing easily. I have one,
although I have never used it. Never was able to ski more than a couple
hundred yards without turning myself into a torpedo.
Untwisting and retwisting a long section of rope really is not an
answer. I want to do this with nylon rope and it doesn't tend to
retwist very well. The only reason a loop splice works with it is
because tensions clamps the strands to each other after its woven.
Well, and I also lightly melt the ends so they stick in place.

Inline splicing of one line into the midspan of the other works well
in nylon 3-strand laid rope, and the better the rope quality the
better and easier splicing works.

Typically, the splice length must be at least six weaves long,
allowing all the stresses and strains to level out.

Knots tend to weaken the lines.

Look in the Ashley Book of Knots for the possibilities.

.<https://ia800506.us.archive.org/32/items/TheAshleyBookOfKnots/the%20ashley%20book%20of%20knots.pdf>

Post by Bob La Londe
The only other thing I can think if is lashing (whipping?) with a light
cord instead of splicing. I'm not sure I am a fan.
Yeah I know how silly that all sounds.

No way will lashing be strong enough or enduring.

Joe

[Jim Wilkins]

"Joe Gwinn" wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...

Inline splicing of one line into the midspan of the other works well
in nylon 3-strand laid rope, and the better the rope quality the
better and easier splicing works.

----------------------------

That should be better than the grommet (ring) I suggested, because the
splice will be in line with the pull.
If the added piece is shorter the continuous main rope will bear all of a
centered load.

[Bob La Londe]

Post by Joe Gwinn
On Wed, 13 Nov 2024 20:08:29 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"

Post by Bob La Londe
Is there a way to put a marlin spike loop mid span in a section of
twisted rope without tying a knot in it?
Back in the winter of 1980/81 I took a small craft and seamanship course
from the USCGA (D-9) with my Uncle Paul. I learned how to back splice,
straight splice, and how to loop splice the ends of a rope, but I'd like
to make a tow harness for a boat that centers the load on both rear tie
down rings. Ideally with a float before the loop, and the splice
extending further than the length of the float. All I've ever used is
loop splices in the real world, but I could figure out the others quick
enough if I had to.
The only thing I can think if is to make two loops through the float
with two different pieces of rope.
I'd like to be able to quickly clip each end on to one of the tie down
rings on a small (relatively) craft and toss the float straight off the
back for a tow line to clip onto. This is not intended for skiing. Its
intended for towing a disable watercraft. In some cases one much
heavier than the tow craft.
For water skiing the ideal setup is to come off a pole well above the
deck with a single line on a mount that can swing easily. I have one,
although I have never used it. Never was able to ski more than a couple
hundred yards without turning myself into a torpedo.
Untwisting and retwisting a long section of rope really is not an
answer. I want to do this with nylon rope and it doesn't tend to
retwist very well. The only reason a loop splice works with it is
because tensions clamps the strands to each other after its woven.
Well, and I also lightly melt the ends so they stick in place.

Inline splicing of one line into the midspan of the other works well
in nylon 3-strand laid rope, and the better the rope quality the
better and easier splicing works.

I had not actually thought of using a second piece of rope to form a
loop in the main line. I could even use that method to increase the
strength of the loop itself so if it did break it would more likely be
one of the lead lines. I could make it a tight loop, or leave a short
regular twist for a float. That is a good idea. I had thought of using
two main lines for the harness or bridle tied together with "hardware"
but didn't really care for it.

Post by Joe Gwinn
Typically, the splice length must be at least six weaves long,
allowing all the stresses and strains to level out.
Knots tend to weaken the lines.
Look in the Ashley Book of Knots for the possibilities.
.<https://ia800506.us.archive.org/32/items/TheAshleyBookOfKnots/the%20ashley%20book%20of%20knots.pdf>

Post by Bob La Londe
The only other thing I can think if is lashing (whipping?) with a light
cord instead of splicing. I'm not sure I am a fan.
Yeah I know how silly that all sounds.

No way will lashing be strong enough or enduring.

Enduring no. I have seen stuff lashed together and work, but the
lashing almost always shows signs of failure if it has been used very
many times. Usually it loosens up and starts to separate eventually
leading to unwrapping.

Post by Joe Gwinn
Joe

[Bob La Londe]

Post by Jim Wilkins
If you are set on splicing you might splice the ends of a "grommet"
within the rope.
A variant of the Prusik knot can be tied in the middle of a rope to add
a loop. It looks somewhat like the Alpine Butterfly, with more turns
around the rope on either side of the loop.
This calls it a dropper knot.
https://www.animatedknots.com/dropper-loop-knot

I am familiar with a dropper loop. In days past I often used it to
attached a hook leader to a mainline with a pass through loop. I'm not
an expert on all common fishing knots, but I know a fair number of them.
As you note the leads are psuhed away from each other with the style
of the knot, but I would still consider it except as Joe notes in his
reply knots do tend to weaken line. Yes I have watched every single
episode or Berkley's Knot Wars series where they compare the strength of
various knots in the three most common types of fishing line, and saw
the claim that some knots were "more than" 100% of line strength. Those
are all freshly tied knots cinched down and stressed to breaking. I
assure you the knot affects line strength over time.

Post by Jim Wilkins
A figure eight loop might be better since your two ends are angled
instead of pulled straight.

A figure 8 knot or even a surgeons loop has an affect on line strength.
In a pinch they are options as is simply tying the rope to the tow point
and losing a few inches with a knife when you are done.

Post by Jim Wilkins
If you want to impress someone you could pre-mark the center of the
sling with tape and tie it to the single tow line with a Carrick Bend.

I have a couple goals, but one of them is to be obvious in use to
somebody who is not as familiar with it. I'd like to make one and give
it to an air boat operator who pulled me off a sand bar last year, and
to throw one in each of the boats I use regularly myself as a permanents
single purpose bridle. It will equalize towing, and also (with the
float) reduce the likelihood of prop fouling when working with a less
skilled boater.

Post by Jim Wilkins
My favorite how'd-he-do-that? is dropping a clove hitch over a bollard
in one smooth quick motion by grabbing the line with arms crossed.

I would like to see that. I tend to tie off mostly to cleats. You just
stack a couple opposing half hitches for a short term tie off. Not the
knot persay, but the cross arm drop.

[Jim Wilkins]

Post by Jim Wilkins
My favorite how'd-he-do-that? is dropping a clove hitch over a bollard
in one smooth quick motion by grabbing the line with arms crossed.

I would like to see that. I tend to tie off mostly to cleats. You just
stack a couple opposing half hitches for a short term tie off. Not the
knot persay, but the cross arm drop.
Bob La Londe
-----------------------------------

[Jim Wilkins]

"Jim Wilkins" wrote in message news:vh5tu4$31f0f$***@dont-email.me...
...instant clove hitch
"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:vh5k08$2v6fq$***@dont-email.me...
...I would like to see that.

Post by Jim Wilkins
http://youtu.be/-T13kEADoHc

Uncrossing the arms forms the loops, swapping which hand + loop is on top
adds the diagonal that completes the knot. It leaves slack in the mooring
line unless adjusted. With practice it can look like magic.